Comments on: When Missionaries Leave on Bad Terms http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms Everything a missionary isn't supposed to say. Thu, 02 Feb 2012 00:35:25 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: C. Holland http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-10873 C. Holland Sat, 18 Dec 2010 20:45:46 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-10873 @cstop: Thanks for your comments. I, too, believe that Europe needs missionaries who are patient and ready for the long-haul. @cstop: Thanks for your comments. I, too, believe that Europe needs missionaries who are patient and ready for the long-haul.

]]> By: cstop http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-10870 cstop Sat, 18 Dec 2010 14:22:17 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-10870 Hi, I grew up in Austria as a daughter to Americans, one of which came as a short-term (2 yr) missionary and stayed on. I agree that it is a very difficult mission field. Tai, you are so right to encourage people not to give up. C. Holland, I totally agree that it's more relational and that change can come slow. I would also like to echo what you said about people thinking they can do things the way they did it at home. Not so. This being said, there are so many beautiful things in our culture (I can speak for the Austrian one, specifically), ways of relating and of seeing life that can be bridges to talking about God. But to discover them one needs to really immerse oneself in the culture. I would like to encourage anyone considering ministry in western Europe to really face the fact that it's going to be difficult, to weigh the cost (alienation, for example, as mentioned above-- I totally agree), and to move forward if it's God's will. We need healthy churches and healthy Christians! Hi,

I grew up in Austria as a daughter to Americans, one of which came as a short-term (2 yr) missionary and stayed on. I agree that it is a very difficult mission field. Tai, you are so right to encourage people not to give up. C. Holland, I totally agree that it’s more relational and that change can come slow. I would also like to echo what you said about people thinking they can do things the way they did it at home. Not so.
This being said, there are so many beautiful things in our culture (I can speak for the Austrian one, specifically), ways of relating and of seeing life that can be bridges to talking about God. But to discover them one needs to really immerse oneself in the culture.
I would like to encourage anyone considering ministry in western Europe to really face the fact that it’s going to be difficult, to weigh the cost (alienation, for example, as mentioned above– I totally agree), and to move forward if it’s God’s will. We need healthy churches and healthy Christians!

]]> By: C. Holland http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-3776 C. Holland Wed, 07 Oct 2009 16:23:12 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-3776 @Tai: You're right, and if God is calling anyone to missions in a place not usual (i.e., outside of the 10/40 window), they should consider God first and foremost, not Man's broad strategy. @Tai: You’re right, and if God is calling anyone to missions in a place not usual (i.e., outside of the 10/40 window), they should consider God first and foremost, not Man’s broad strategy.

]]> By: tai fu http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-3752 tai fu Sat, 03 Oct 2009 02:58:00 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-3752 Also in response to the article itself, I would say if you feel called to be in Europe as a missionary first of all, DO NOT give up. This is true for missionary work anywhere though. Also don't expect an easy ride just because you're called to go to a developed country as a missionary, because usually people are less sensitive spiritually so that means you may have to work for a long time without much progress, but be persistent and you should see something. Getting people to support you may be a challenge though since people have this preconceived idea that missionaries goes to the remote jungle of South America or Africa and live in huts or tents for the rest of their life, and that Europe is just a vacation destination, or for those living in Asia, a place everyone wants to immigrate to. By the way there was a missionary to Burma that had only led one person to Christ in his whole life, but that one person led many more to Christ, so in short, ONE is worth the effort! Also in response to the article itself, I would say if you feel called to be in Europe as a missionary first of all, DO NOT give up. This is true for missionary work anywhere though. Also don’t expect an easy ride just because you’re called to go to a developed country as a missionary, because usually people are less sensitive spiritually so that means you may have to work for a long time without much progress, but be persistent and you should see something. Getting people to support you may be a challenge though since people have this preconceived idea that missionaries goes to the remote jungle of South America or Africa and live in huts or tents for the rest of their life, and that Europe is just a vacation destination, or for those living in Asia, a place everyone wants to immigrate to. By the way there was a missionary to Burma that had only led one person to Christ in his whole life, but that one person led many more to Christ, so in short, ONE is worth the effort!

]]> By: tai fu http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-3698 tai fu Fri, 25 Sep 2009 08:17:47 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-3698 Racism is everywhere though, except in my country it's racism towards itself. Here in Taiwan locals have problem getting jobs teaching English, mostly it's white people getting those jobs and they get paid a lot, while the same person who is Asian gets paid half as much even if his or her English is just as good or better than the white person (as in someone who was raised in the USA). However even in Taiwan people are racist towards people from Indonesia or Philippines or Vietnam. I do find that if you love someone, even if he is hostile sometimes it can turn him or her around but other times it may never change... Racism is everywhere though, except in my country it’s racism towards itself. Here in Taiwan locals have problem getting jobs teaching English, mostly it’s white people getting those jobs and they get paid a lot, while the same person who is Asian gets paid half as much even if his or her English is just as good or better than the white person (as in someone who was raised in the USA). However even in Taiwan people are racist towards people from Indonesia or Philippines or Vietnam. I do find that if you love someone, even if he is hostile sometimes it can turn him or her around but other times it may never change…

]]> By: C. Holland http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-3696 C. Holland Fri, 25 Sep 2009 06:58:27 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-3696 @Tai: Thank you for sharing your experiences. I'm afraid the racist issue is something to be overcome, even in my field in Western Europe. I'm very aware that if I didn't look European I would be treated very differently. @Tai: Thank you for sharing your experiences. I’m afraid the racist issue is something to be overcome, even in my field in Western Europe. I’m very aware that if I didn’t look European I would be treated very differently.

]]> By: Tai Fu http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-3690 Tai Fu Fri, 25 Sep 2009 02:48:48 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-3690 I went to Germany for two months, to do a Disciple Training School with YWAM. Europe is expensive, and I can tell you for a fact that it's the most difficult mission field in the world. Yes you get all the first world facilities and stuff like that but the people aren't really friendly especially towards foreigners, especially foreigners that don't look white. Also as most people said, Europe is mostly secular and the percentages of people who even wants to evangelize is very small, and sometimes even evangelizing will almost paint you as a racist. I can tell you there are times that I hated Europe and wanted to leave and not come back, and its very easy to feel alienated there. However I still feel called to Europe and despite the setback I want to be back as soon as possible, not because I want to be in Europe or whatever, but I do know that there are a very high percentage of Muslims in many parts of Europe and the percentage is rising rapidly. I felt that there are great opportunities in Europe to reach out to them. I will still continue working with YWAM and to be honest with you, looking at what some other organization require as far as support YWAM is actually quite reasonable, they require a 300 euro monthly support which is enough, and oftentimes this isn't a hard and fast number as they will take in people with NO support. They offer housing but the costs are very low so the support really just covers what is required (insurance, house, food, etc) and everything else done as a team is often taken on faith, and they have been very successful on that. I would say be VERY careful with agencies because most of the time they're out to make a profit often using Christianity as a mask. Many missionaries have gone out without organizational support and God has really blessed them. Please read Luke chapter 10 to find out how Jesus really sent people out. It is our job to do what God tells us to do and it's God's job to provide for us (Matthew chapter 6). I went to Germany for two months, to do a Disciple Training School with YWAM. Europe is expensive, and I can tell you for a fact that it’s the most difficult mission field in the world. Yes you get all the first world facilities and stuff like that but the people aren’t really friendly especially towards foreigners, especially foreigners that don’t look white. Also as most people said, Europe is mostly secular and the percentages of people who even wants to evangelize is very small, and sometimes even evangelizing will almost paint you as a racist. I can tell you there are times that I hated Europe and wanted to leave and not come back, and its very easy to feel alienated there. However I still feel called to Europe and despite the setback I want to be back as soon as possible, not because I want to be in Europe or whatever, but I do know that there are a very high percentage of Muslims in many parts of Europe and the percentage is rising rapidly. I felt that there are great opportunities in Europe to reach out to them. I will still continue working with YWAM and to be honest with you, looking at what some other organization require as far as support YWAM is actually quite reasonable, they require a 300 euro monthly support which is enough, and oftentimes this isn’t a hard and fast number as they will take in people with NO support. They offer housing but the costs are very low so the support really just covers what is required (insurance, house, food, etc) and everything else done as a team is often taken on faith, and they have been very successful on that.

I would say be VERY careful with agencies because most of the time they’re out to make a profit often using Christianity as a mask. Many missionaries have gone out without organizational support and God has really blessed them. Please read Luke chapter 10 to find out how Jesus really sent people out. It is our job to do what God tells us to do and it’s God’s job to provide for us (Matthew chapter 6).

]]> By: C. Holland http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-204 C. Holland Sat, 14 Feb 2009 11:49:08 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-204 Thanks for the update. Sounds like he is checking into other possibilities, which is a good start. 4 years is a LONG commitment, especially to someone in their 20's and for so much money (now with the economy, too). He needs to think about this seriously, but I will say a lot of others thought we were totally nuts and wouldn't last here--but we have. Whichever agency he decides to go through, I would absolutely talk to references that are former and current missionaries with that agency. We actually started out with an agency but were able to talk to references about them, which saved us from going with them as we and the agency were not on the same page. Our funding had not started through them, which was helpful as they eventually folded. Thanks for the update. Sounds like he is checking into other possibilities, which is a good start. 4 years is a LONG commitment, especially to someone in their 20′s and for so much money (now with the economy, too). He needs to think about this seriously, but I will say a lot of others thought we were totally nuts and wouldn’t last here–but we have.

Whichever agency he decides to go through, I would absolutely talk to references that are former and current missionaries with that agency. We actually started out with an agency but were able to talk to references about them, which saved us from going with them as we and the agency were not on the same page. Our funding had not started through them, which was helpful as they eventually folded.

]]> By: Greg in Mexico http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-202 Greg in Mexico Fri, 13 Feb 2009 14:31:44 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-202 The following is an email exchange between the young man and I on facebook: Chuck...help me understand why this school or missions agency is asking you to raise $16,000 in "one time" (what does that mean & where does it go?) in addition to $4,000 a month. Why aren't they providing you with at least free room and board in Vienna? I think it's highly irresponsible for them to ask a young man to raise that much money. I know Europe is expensive but is it really THAT expensive? It seems they're setting you up for failure dude. Hear me Chuck - I'm in no way questioning your heart or your calling in this. You are as godly and genuine as they come. What I *am* questioning is an overseas school or missions agency that's using a young man like yourself as a cash cow. To me it smacks of exploitation. Where is their commitment to YOU? I know you're going there to serve them, but it is not unreasonable to ask or expect some assistance from their part considering the high level of what they are asking of you financially. For example, here in Mexico our cash-strapped Mexican Bible School can't pay us salaries but they do provide us with housing and pay all our utilities. They refused to accept any rent when we offered it. That's the kind of commitment I'm talking about. Love ya & am NOT trying to discourage you in any way!!! CHUCK REPLIED: Greg! Sorry it took a little bit to reply. Well, I'm in the process of considering switching mission's orgs. Most teachers at the school go through [name deleted]. Compared to [deleted], the budget is much more manageable. $2,300/month compared to $4,000 a month and $9,000 one-time compared to the $16,000. I'm not sure why [school name deleted] doesn't have room and board for their teachers (my understanding would probably be because of the cost for the school to do that and because the school is independent of any church or mission org). However, the school does offer health insurance, life insurance, and $300/month if I commit to 4 years at the school - which I'm considering. I'm talking with my [name deleted] contact tomorrow about the possibility of switching all the support I have over to [name deleted]. Please pray that [name deleted] is willing to do this - because I have almost $6,000 of one-time support already given. However, I won't have any trouble transferring over the pledged monthly support - which is about $800/month. Thanks for the message! Take care bro. ~ Chuck The following is an email exchange between the young man and I on facebook:

Chuck…help me understand why this school or missions agency is asking you to raise $16,000 in “one time” (what does that mean & where does it go?) in addition to $4,000 a month. Why aren’t they providing you with at least free room and board in Vienna? I think it’s highly irresponsible for them to ask a young man to raise that much money. I know Europe is expensive but is it really THAT expensive? It seems they’re setting you up for failure dude.

Hear me Chuck – I’m in no way questioning your heart or your calling in this. You are as godly and genuine as they come. What I *am* questioning is an overseas school or missions agency that’s using a young man like yourself as a cash cow. To me it smacks of exploitation. Where is their commitment to YOU? I know you’re going there to serve them, but it is not unreasonable to ask or expect some assistance from their part considering the high level of what they are asking of you financially. For example, here in Mexico our cash-strapped Mexican Bible School can’t pay us salaries but they do provide us with housing and pay all our utilities. They refused to accept any rent when we offered it. That’s the kind of commitment I’m talking about.

Love ya & am NOT trying to discourage you in any way!!!

CHUCK REPLIED:

Greg! Sorry it took a little bit to reply.

Well, I’m in the process of considering switching mission’s orgs. Most teachers at the school go through [name deleted]. Compared to [deleted], the budget is much more manageable. $2,300/month compared to $4,000 a month and $9,000 one-time compared to the $16,000.

I’m not sure why [school name deleted] doesn’t have room and board for their teachers (my understanding would probably be because of the cost for the school to do that and because the school is independent of any church or mission org). However, the school does offer health insurance, life insurance, and $300/month if I commit to 4 years at the school – which I’m considering.

I’m talking with my [name deleted] contact tomorrow about the possibility of switching all the support I have over to [name deleted]. Please pray that [name deleted] is willing to do this – because I have almost $6,000 of one-time support already given. However, I won’t have any trouble transferring over the pledged monthly support – which is about $800/month.

Thanks for the message! Take care bro.

~ Chuck

]]> By: C. Holland http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/when-missionaries-leave-on-bad-terms/comment-page-1#comment-200 C. Holland Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:19:36 +0000 http://www.missionaryconfidential.com/?p=48#comment-200 Other questions for him: does he know the language enough to get around? So many don't bother in a new field, and it's a mistake. Also, can he handle the prejudice he will receive as: an immigrant, a foreigner, an American, a minority, a missionary? None of those things are respected (making a generalisation, I know). Other questions for him: does he know the language enough to get around? So many don’t bother in a new field, and it’s a mistake. Also, can he handle the prejudice he will receive as: an immigrant, a foreigner, an American, a minority, a missionary? None of those things are respected (making a generalisation, I know).

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